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Talk:Kinder, Küche, Kirche

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Untitled

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What IS the most common permutation of this phrase? Yubyub 23:01, 4 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I just got the following Google hits:
  • Kinder, Küche, Kirche - 16,700
  • Küche, Kirche, Kinder - 819
  • Kinder, Kirche, Küche - 685
  • Küche, Kinder, Kirche - 561
  • Kirche, Kinder, Küche - 494
  • Kirche, Küche, Kinder - 281
I'll change the title and the opening sentence accordingly. --Angr/tɔk tə mi 18:32, 21 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I'm from germany and lived all my life here. The "three K's" are not a common phrase in germany. Actually I read about them here on the us-site of wiki for the first time and never heard about that before. Also there is no women discrimination. Maybe the facts about buisiness are right, but womens have and use absolutely the same rights as men. This is also written down in the Basic Constitutional Law of germany and you can go to law if you are treaten wrong like one woman did in 2001 who wanted to go to the bundeswehr (military).

My dear countryman,
yes, the the three Ks should not be seen as a description of current situations, despite some discrimination occuring (but that's nothing spectecular)
the three Ks are a common phrase, though are meant polemically against such containing women in certain spheres.
the case of the Bundeswehr woman however is different, as it was the European court that forced Germany to allow her as a soldier, quite a problematic verdict IMHO, given that this in effect overrode the German constitution. Str1977 (smile back)

Too much Nazi/Hitler

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Yes, Nazis encouraged that babys are being born, and so did (or do) other politicians and governments, actively or passively. But the church connection is wrong, the Nazis tried to replace Christain beliefs with their own, pagan ideas. The article needs to shift focus to post WW2 use. --Matthead 11:19, 9 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The phrase predated the Nazis, but the Nazis did use it in their propaganda. Therefore, it is appropriate to include it here. The article addresses post WW2 use, but most references to this expression note that this was the belief of the Nazis. See for example this article--Thalia42 11:38, 9 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Where did the Nazis use this exact phrase in their propaganda? I'm German and I'm not aware of any example, do you have one? Otherwise remove the part about the "use of the 3 Ks in propaganda".--84.188.191.130 15:54, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The Nazis certainly did not use this in propaganda. This never was used in propaganda as it is quite a polemic phrase. And in its origins it wasn't intended so much to restrict women but to allow men to leave these "jobs" to their wives and concentrate on "more important fields" like politics and pubs. Later the term was used to criticize the restriction of women to these fields. As far as your link goes, it doesn't provide evidence that the Nazis used it - rather it is one more example of using the term to criticize something. Str1977 (smile back) 10:58, 3 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Naomi Weisstein

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She was born in 1939 in the United States and therefore must be an absolute authority on all matters German and Nazi. Or is it her Jewish pedigree that makes her an authority? Do you believe she's impartial and unbiased? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.109.171.106 (talk • contribs) 10:50, May 6, 2007

And how about you? --Cyfal (talk) 22:25, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Mostly in English?

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I don't think the phrase has been in use mostly in the English-speaking world. It's a well-known phrase in German and I've certainly seen more instances of it in German than English texts. Google reports 4330 hits on German pages vs 1790 on English pages (some of which are actually in German). --88.74.195.209 (talk) 21:26, 26 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Traditional Values Not Nazism

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I have a problem with this phrase being used to vilify women or people that think women should live traditional roles in society and are content with doiong so and I believe that article is feminist scorn for woemn and traditional rtoles for women, for women that choose to live this way. I oppose sexism in all forms, but vilifying traditional culture as being like Nazi Germany is something I find disgust with. This article sounds like it was written by a militant feminist that does not the choices of women to live traditional lives and smears tdational values of average people that go to church, raise families, and all that, in normal small town culture as "sexist" and suggestive of sexism. The Nazis restricted women, that's sexism, yes, but the phrase being used in the pejorative sense to smear traditional lives of average everyday women throught America as being Nazi like is highly disgusting and it wreaks of militant feminist hatred of how people choose to live their lives and hatred of male society. I hate sexism, I also hate militant feminists that use this term to vilify traditional lifestyles of how people like things as usual or hatred of the average society and radical feminist change of society to force their male-hating views on average every day people by saying that although women's roles have chan ged, I acknowledge that, the whole using this to bash regular society and everything being sexist and wrong, to destroy the traditions people have and the way they live their lives to advance an agenda, I think this article is disgusting. Does anyone here feel that Wikipedia is militantly feminist lately? Women have changed, but SOME women do wish to live this way and ridiculing traditonal average everyday society as being like Nazi Germany, is ridiculous, asinine and completely ignorant and stupid to suggest that women are repressed so that women can dominate society and hate men, is just plain ridiuclous. I think that it should be a pejorative term used by feminists and nothing more.

Traditional lives of women who go to church, cook, and have children, AND CHOOSE To live this way out of their own free will, is NOT sexist at all. This is incredibly stupid. 03:16, 22 February 2012 (UTC)~ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.11.158.220 (talk)

It's a stupid article written by stupid people. But who cares, if you didn't buy in to the "it's antiquated and therefore Nazi blah blah" argument, congratulations, you don't have to spend your life like those who did. For one, maybe you followed the religious guidance that helped keep you from making poor decisions in the moment, without foresight. Maybe you learned to cook, and actually have time to. Well, so many women are their 20s, 30s or older eating terrible food and living terribly unhealthy lives, and they are going to have all kinds of health problems. Many of them are getting ever fatter and, for this reason, losing the attention of potential partners who are already less interested because, for those in the 30s, looks are folding anyway (who would have ever thought that looks match up with fertility, it's almost as if there is a reason for that). Such women are also getting ignored by those who actually would have wanted to have children and a family (who they probably were inclined to be overlooked earlier, because somebody wanted free-spirit, for-the-moment fun). Well, maybe you aren't the one who is alone (save a few dogs or cats) spending the rest of the life watching everything you love die; instead, maybe you are watching things you love grow older. And maybe you are the one with family and loving company, instead of being surrounded by colleagues who are shallow and backstabbing, and bosses who are callous, critical and unforgiving. And maybe you aren't sitting at a cubicle pretending you are happy 5 days a week, for over 40 hours each week, just so you can buy things and pretend to be happy. And maybe you also have somebody supportive in your life. Maybe you also will see your kind prosper and flourish, unlike the ones whose ideology of anti-kinder, kueche kirche is killing them and their kind off like a cancer. And maybe that's just quite all right, there are too many people on this planet anyway. Good riddance to them. 2600:1002:B016:8806:40F:919:BA44:ACD5 (talk) 06:47, 7 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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