Wikipedia:Categories for discussion

"WP:CFD" redirects here. For criteria for deletion, see WP:Criteria for deletion.

"WP:CFR" redirects here. For criteria for redaction, see WP:Criteria for redaction.

XFD backlog

V	Aug	Sep	Oct	Nov	Total
CfD	0	0	0	0	0
TfD	0	0	0	0	0
MfD	0	0	2	5	7
FfD	0	0	2	2	4
RfD	0	0	21	11	32
AfD	0	0	0	0	0

Categories for discussion (CfD) is the central venue for discussing specific proposals to delete, merge, rename or split categories and stub types in accordance with the guidelines for categorization, category naming and stub articles.

For detailed instructions about using CfD, see "How to use CfD" below. Briefly, nominations are handled through one of two processes:

1. Speedy renaming and merging, for uncontroversial proposals that meet specified criteria—see "Speedy renaming and merging" below.
2. Full discussion, for all other proposals. Discussions typically remain open for at least seven days and are closed once a rough consensus has formed or no objections to the nomination are raised.

Except in uncontroversial cases such as reverting vandalism, do not amend or depopulate a category once it has been nominated at CfD as this hampers other editors' efforts to evaluate a category and participate in the discussion.

When a category is renamed or merged with another category, in limited circumstances it may be helpful to leave an instance of the {{Category redirect|...}} template on the category's former page. See "Redirecting categories" below for more information.

Wikipedia:Move review can be used to contest the outcome of a CfD request that is limited in scope to renaming, as long as all steps are followed. If a discussion on the request closer's talk page does not resolve an issue, then a move review will evaluate the close of a CfD move discussion to determine whether or not the close was reasonable and consistent with the spirit and intent of common practice, policies, and guidelines. CfDs involving deletion should be reviewed at Wikipedia:Deletion review.

Scope

CfD is intended only for specific proposals to delete, merge, rename or split categories or stub types. For general discussion about how to improve the category system, use other appropriate venues such as Wikipedia talk:Categorization, Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Categories, and any relevant WikiProjects' talk pages.

Current discussions

Add a new entry

• All current discussions
  • 10 November (Sunday)
  • 9 November (Saturday)
  • 8 November (Friday)
  • 7 November (Thursday)
  • 6 November (Wednesday)
  • 5 November (Tuesday)
  • 4 November (Monday)
  • 3 November (Sunday)
  • Previous 8 to 21 days
• Speedy renaming requests
• Archive and indices

Discussions awaiting closure

See also the list of individual discussions awaiting closure here and the list of full open discussions awaiting closure here.

How to use CfD

Nomination procedure

Twinkle

You may use Twinkle to facilitate CfD nominations. To install Twinkle, go to Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets and check "Twinkle" in the "Browsing" section. Use the now-installed "XfD" (Start a deletion discussion) tab while viewing the page you want to nominate.

Twinkle only allows you to nominate a single category or stub template. For bundled nominations including multiple categories, see § MassCFD.

MassCFD

You can use the script User:Qwerfjkl/scripts/massXFD to automatically make mass nominations.

Manual nominations

I	Preliminary steps. Before nominating a category: Read and understand the guidance for category names and overcategorization. For categories containing biographical articles, read the guidance for categorization of people. For categories containing the user pages of Wikipedians, read the guidance for user categories. In the following special cases: If a category is a red link, then it is already deleted (or was never created in the first place) and does not need to be nominated. If a category is unpopulated, use {{db-catempty}} to request it be speedily deleted in 7 days. If a category is populated solely by a template (other than a stub template, see #Stub types below) and you are proposing to delete both the category and template, follow the instructions at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion. For further information, see Wikipedia:Categorization and Wikipedia:Manual of Style.
II	Edit the category. Add one of the following templates at the beginning of the category page (not the talk page) of every category to be discussed. For nominations involving large numbers of categories, help adding these templates can be requested here. Otherwise, if nominating a single category: For deleting, use {{subst:Cfd}} For merging, use {{subst:Cfm|Other category}} For merging to two categories, use {{subst:Cfm-double|Other category 1|Other category 2}} For renaming, use {{subst:Cfr|Proposed name}} For splitting, use {{subst:Cfs|Proposed name 1|Proposed name 2}} For converting the category into a list, use {{subst:Cfl|Proposed name}} For other options (containerization, etc.), use {{subst:Cfd|type=nature of proposed discussion}} (see Template:Cfd/doc#Optional parameter) If nominating a group of related categories, use a bundled nomination: For deleting, use {{subst:Cfd|CfD section name}} For merging, use {{subst:Cfm|Other category|CfD section name}} For merging to two categories, use {{subst:Cfm-double|Other category 1|Other category 2|CfD section name}} For renaming, use {{subst:Cfr|Proposed name|CfD section name}} For splitting, use {{subst:Cfs|Proposed name 1|Proposed name 2|CfD section name}} For converting the category into a list, {{subst:Cfl|Proposed name|CfD section name}} For other options (containerization, etc.), use {{subst:Cfd|type=nature of proposed discussion|CfD section name}} (see Template:Cfd/doc#Optional parameter) Include "CfD", "CfM", "CfR", "CfS" or "CfL" in the edit summary, and do not mark the edit as minor. Preview before saving. To add the template for previous nomination days, use the "full" version of the template by appending "full" to the template name, i.e. {{cfd full}}, {{cfm full}}, {{cfr full}}, {{cfs full}} and {{cfl full}}. Use the |day=, |month= and |year= parameters to make the banner link to the correct CfD page. Consider adding {{subst:cfd notice|Category name|2024 November 10|CfD section name}} ~~~~ to the talk page of the category's creator. For details about these templates, see each template's documentation.
III	Create the CFD section. Click THIS LINK to edit the section of CfD for today's entries. Follow the instructions (visible in edit mode) to copy and paste one of the templates below. When inserting category names into these template's parameters, except the text= parameter, omit the Category: prefix and do not use wikilinks, as the template takes care of this. If nominating a single category: For deleting, use {{subst:Cfd2|Obsolete category|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed deletion. ~~~~}} For merging, use {{subst:Cfm2|Origin category|Destination category|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed merge. ~~~~}} For merging to two categories, use {{subst:Cfm2|Origin category|Destination category 1|target2=Destination category 2|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed merge. ~~~~}} For renaming, use {{subst:Cfr2|Current category|Proposed name|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed rename. ~~~~}} For splitting, use {{subst:Cfs2|Current category|Proposed category 1|Proposed category 2|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed split. ~~~~}} For converting the category into a list, use {{subst:Cfc2|Current category|Proposed article|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed conversion. ~~~~}} For other options (containerization, etc.), use {{subst:Cfd2|Current category|type=other type|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed conversion. ~~~~}} For a bundled nomination, use one of the standard templates to build the "Cfd section name" for the first nominated category. After saving that, the second and subsequent nominations must be inserted manually, as follows: ==== Cfd section name ==== * 1st category * 2nd category [Make clear whether you propose deletion, merging or renaming] * Your reason for nominating the categories, and signature. If a bundled nomination is too long, consider using {{hidden}} to hide some of the nominated categories. In your reason, use links if mentioning articles or categories. To link to a category, use the colon trick by adding a colon (:) to the beginning of the link, e.g. [[:Category:Foo]]. Preview before saving to check that your nomination is formatted correctly, and remember to include your signature at the end of the nomination.

Stub types

I	Preliminary steps. In general, a stub type consists of a stub template and a dedicated stub category. Before nominating a stub type for deletion, merging or renaming: Read and understand guidance for creating stub types and stub type naming conventions. Review the list of existing stub types—be advised, this list may not be comprehensive. If you wish to: Create a new stub type—follow the procedure for proposing new stub types. Delete, merge or rename a stub category only, without deleting or renaming the associated stub template—follow the instructions above this section. Delete or rename a stub template—continue to section II.
II	Edit the template. Add one of the following tags at the beginning of the template to be discussed. For deletion, use {{subst:Sfd-t|Section name}} For renaming, use {{subst:Sfr-t|Proposed name|Section name}} Please include "SFD" or "SFR" in the edit summary, and don't mark the edit as minor. Preview before saving. Consider notifying the template's creator on their talk page. To find the contributor, check the page history of the stub template.
III	Create the CFD section. Click THIS LINK to edit the section of CfD for today's entries. Follow the instructions (visible in edit mode) and paste the following text (remember to update the default parameters): For deletion, use {{subst:sfd-t2|TemplateName|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed deletion. ~~~~}} For renaming, use {{subst:sfr-t2|TemplateOldName|TemplateNewName|text=Your reason(s) for the proposed deletion. ~~~~}} In your rationale, mention how many articles currently use the template to help other editors. When linking to a category in your rationale, always add a colon (:) to the beginning of the link, like [[:Category:Foo]]. This makes a category link that can be seen on the page, and avoids putting this page into the category you are nominating. Preview before saving to check that your nomination is formatted correctly, and remember to include your signature at the end of the nomination.

Notifying interested projects and editors

In addition to the steps listed above, you may choose to invite participation by editors who are likely to be informed about a nominated category. All such efforts must comply with Wikipedia's guideline against biased canvassing. In addition, to help make your messages about the CfD discussion clear, avoid Wikipedia-specific abbreviations, link to relevant policies or guidelines, and link to the discussion itself.

Notifying related WikiProjects

WikiProjects consist of groups of editors who are interested in a particular subject. If a nominated category is within the scope of one or more WikiProjects, consider adding a brief, neutral note on their talk page(s) about the nomination. You may use {{subst:cfd notice|Category name|2024 November 10|CfD section name}} ~~~~ or write a personalized message.

Tagging the nominated category's talk page with a relevant WikiProject's banner will include the category in that WikiProject's Article Alerts if they subscribe to the system. For instance, tagging a nominated category with {{WikiProject Physics}} will add the discussion to Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Article alerts.

Notifying substantial contributors to the category

While not required, it is generally considered courteous to notify the good-faith creator and main contributors of the category that you are nominating for discussion. To find the creator and main contributors, check the category's page history or talk page. You may use {{Cfd notice}} to inform the category's creator and all other editors.

Notifying other interested editors

It may be helpful to invite other subject-matter experts by posting a message on the talk page of the most closely related article, such as Protein family for Category:Protein families. You may use {{Cfdnotice}} for this.

Closing procedure

After seven days, someone will close the discussion according to the consensus that formed or, if needed, relist it to allow more discussion. Editors closing discussions must follow the administrator instructions and, except in the case of a "keep" or "no consensus" outcome, implement the result or log it at the Working page to ensure it is implemented.

Redirecting categories

"WP:CAT-R" redirects here. For the guideline on categorizing redirects, see Wikipedia:Categorizing redirects.

For an essay on this topic, see WP:Category redirects that should be kept.

In general, an unpopulated category should be deleted (see speedy deletion criterion C1) because it is not useful for navigation and sorting. In limited circumstances, and because categories cannot be redirected using "hard" redirects (i.e. #REDIRECT[[''target'']]), we use a form of "soft redirect" to solve the issue. You can create a category redirect by adding {{Category redirect|target}} to the category page. Bots patrol these categories and move articles into the "redirect" targets.

In particular, category redirects are used at the former category name when we convert hyphens into en dashes (e.g. Category:Canada-Russia relations → Category:Canada–Russia relations). It is also helpful to set up category redirects from titles with plain letters (i.e. characters on a standard keyboard) where the category names include diacritics.

A list of redirected categories is available at Category:Wikipedia soft redirected categories.

Speedy renaming and merging

Speedy renaming or speedy merging of categories may be requested only if they meet a speedy criterion, for example WP:C2D (consistency with main article's name) or WP:C2C (consistency with established category tree names). Please see instructions below.

1. Determine which speedy criterion applies
2. Tag category page with {{subst:cfr-speedy|New name}} or {{subst:cfm-speedy|Merge target}}
3. List request along with speedy criteria reason under "Current requests" below on this page

Please note that a speedy request must state which of the narrowly defined criteria strictly applies. Hence, any other non-speedy criteria, even "common sense" or "obvious", may be suitable points, but only at a full discussion at WP:Categories for discussion.

Requests may take 48 hours to process after listing if there are no objections. This delay allows other users to review the request to ensure that it meets the speedy criteria for speedy renaming or merging, and to raise objections to the proposed change.

Categories that qualify for speedy deletion (per Wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion, e.g., "patent nonsense", "recreation") can be tagged with the regular speedy tags, such as {{db|reason}} with no required delay. Empty categories can be deleted if they remain empty 7 days after tagging with {{db-empty}}. Renaming under C2E may also be processed instantly (at the discretion of an administrator) as it is a variation on G7.

To oppose a speedy request you must record your objection within 48 hours of the nomination. Do this by inserting immediately under the nomination:

• Oppose, (the reasons for your objection). ~~~~

You will not be able to do this by editing the page WP:Categories for discussion. Instead, you should edit the section WP:Categories for discussion#Add requests for speedy renaming and merging here or the page WP:Categories for discussion/Speedy#Add requests for speedy renaming and merging here (WP:CFDS). Be aware that in the course of any discussion, the nomination and its discussion may get moved further down the page purely for organizational convenience – you may need to search WP:CFDS to find the new location. Participate in any ongoing discussion, but unless you withdraw your opposition, a knowledgeable person may eventually bring forward the nomination and discussion to become a regular CFD discussion. At that stage you may add further comments, but your initial opposition will still be considered. However, if after seven days there has been no support for the request, and no response from the nominator, the request may be dropped from further consideration as a speedy.

Contested speedy requests become stale, and can be untagged and delisted after 7 days of inactivity. Optionally, if the discussion may be useful for future reference, it may be copied to the category talk page, with a section heading and {{moved discussion from|[[WP:CFDS]]|2=~~~~}}. If the nominator wants to revive the process, this may be requested at WP:Categories for discussion (CfD) in accordance with its instructions.

If you belatedly notice and want to oppose a speedy move that has already been processed, contact one of the admins who process the Speedy page. If your objection seems valid, they may reverse the move, or start a full CFD discussion.

Speedy criteria

The category-specific criteria for speedy renaming, or merging are strictly limited to:

C2A: Typographic and spelling fixes

• Correction of spelling errors and capitalization fixes. Differences between British and American spelling (e.g. Harbours → Harbors) are not considered errors; however if the convention of the relevant category tree is to use one form over the other then a rename may be appropriate under C2C. If both spellings exist as otherwise-identical category names, they should be merged.
• Appropriate conversion of hyphens into en dashes or vice versa (e.g. Category:Canada-Russia relations → Category:Canada–Russia relations).
• Correction of obvious grammatical errors, such as a missing conjunction (e.g. Individual frogs toads → Individual frogs and toads). This includes pluralizing a noun in the name of a set category, but not when disagreement might reasonably be anticipated as to whether the category is a topic or set category.

C2B: Consistency with established Wikipedia naming conventions and practices

• Expanding abbreviated country names (e.g. U.S. → United States).
• Disambiguation fixes from an unqualified name (e.g. Category:Washington → Category:Washington (state) or Category:Washington, D.C.).

C2C: Consistency with established category tree names

Bringing a category into line with established naming conventions for that category tree, or into line with the various "x by y", "x of y", or "x in y" categorization conventions specified at Wikipedia:Category names

• This should be used only where there is no room for doubt that the category in question is being used for the standard purpose instead of being a potential subcategory.
• This criterion should be applied only when there is no ambiguity or doubt over the existence of a category naming convention. Such a convention must be well defined and must be overwhelmingly used within the tree. If this is not the case then the category in question must be brought forward to a full Cfd nomination.
• This criterion will not apply in cases where the category tree observes distinctions in local usage (e.g. Category:Transportation in the United States and Category:Transport in the United Kingdom).

C2D: Consistency with main article's name

• Renaming a topic category to match its eponymous page (e.g. Category:The Beatles and The Beatles).
• This applies only if the related page's current name (and by extension, the proposed name for the category) is:
  • unambiguous (so it generally does not apply to proposals to remove a disambiguator from the category name, even when the main article is the primary topic of its name, i.e. it does not contain a disambiguator); and
  • uncontroversial, either because of longstanding stability at that particular name, or because the page was just moved (i) after a page move discussion resulted in explicit consensus to rename, or (ii) unilaterally to reflect an official renaming which is verified by one or more citations (provided in the nomination). C2D does not apply if the result would be contrary to guidelines at WP:CATNAME, or there is any ongoing discussion about the name of the page or category, or there has been a recent discussion concerning any of the pages that resulted in a no consensus result, or it is controversial in some other way.
• This criterion may also be used to rename a set category in the same circumstances, where the set is defined by a renamed topic; e.g. players for a sports team, or places in a district.
• Before nominating a category to be renamed per WP:C2D, consider whether it makes more sense to move the article instead of the category.

C2E: Author request

• This criterion applies only if the author of a category requests or agrees to renaming within six months of creating the category.
• The criterion does not apply if other editors have populated or changed the category since it was created. "Other editors" includes bots that populated the category, but excludes an editor working with the author on the renaming.

C2F: One eponymous page

• This criterion applies if the category contains only an eponymous article, list, template or media file, provided that the category has not otherwise been emptied shortly before the nomination. The default outcome is an upmerge to the parent categories, where applicable. Nominations should use {{subst:cfm-speedy}} (speedy merger) linking to a suitable parent category, or to another appropriate category (e.g. one that is currently on the article). When listing the nomination at WP:CFDS, you must manually add all the appropriate parent categories as targets if the member page is not already in them.

Admin instructions

When handling the listings:

1. Make sure that the listing meets one of the above criteria.
2. With the exception of C2E, make sure that it was both listed and tagged at least 48 hours previously.
3. Make sure that there is no opposition to the listing; if there is a discussion, check if the opposing user(s) ended up withdrawing their opposition.

If the listing meets these criteria, simply have the category renamed or merged – follow the instructions at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Administrator instructions, in the section "If the decision is to Rename, Merge, or Delete"; to list it for the bots, use the Speedy moves section.

Applying speedy criteria in full discussions

• A nomination to merge or rename, brought forward as a full CfD, may be speedily closed if the closing administrator is satisfied that:
  • The nomination clearly falls within the scope of one of the criteria listed here, and
  • No objections have been made within 48 hours of the initial nomination.
• If both these conditions are satisfied, the closure will be regarded as having been a result of a speedy nomination. If any objections have been raised then the CfD nomination will remain in place for the usual 7-day discussion period, to be decided in accordance with expressed consensus.

Add requests for speedy renaming and merging here

If the category and desired change do not match one of the criteria mentioned in C2, do not list it here. Instead, list it in the main CFD section.

If you are in any doubt as to whether it qualifies, do not list it here.

Use the following format on a new line at the beginning of the list:

* [[:Category:old name]] to [[:Category:new name]] – Reason ~~~~

If the current name should be redirected rather than deleted, use:

* REDIRECT [[:Category:old name]] to [[:Category:new name]] – Reason ~~~~

To note that human action is required, e.g. updating a template that populates the category, use:

* NO BOTS [[:Category:old name]] to [[:Category:new name]] – Reason ~~~~

Remember to tag the category page with: {{subst:cfr-speedy|New name}}

A request may be completed if it is more than 48 hours old; that is, if the time stamp shown is earlier than 23:06, 8 November 2024 (UTC). Currently, there are 88 open requests ().

Current requests

Please add new requests at the top of the list, preferably with a link to the parent category (in case of C2C) or relevant article (in case of C2D).

• Category:Carniolan linguists to Category:Linguists from Carniola – C2C: norm is Linguists from FOO ^SMason_Garrison 23:05, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Dyffryn Nantlle to Category:Nantlle Valley – C2D with Nantlle Valley. DankJae 20:56, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Pulitzer Prize for General Non-Fiction winners to Category:Pulitzer Prize for General Nonfiction winners – C2D: Every source from I can find indicates the Prize has always been titled with 'Nonfiction', not 'Non-Fiction'. The main article was moved[1] back in 2017 to correct this. Οἶδα (talk) 19:25, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:Pulitzer Prize for General Non-Fiction–winning works to Category:Pulitzer Prize for General Nonfiction–winning works – C2D:
• Category:Min Kingdom to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) – C2D: per Min (Ten Kingdoms). Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 19:10, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:Min Kingdom people to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) people
  • Category:Min Kingdom Buddhists to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) Buddhists
  • Category:Min Kingdom empresses to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) empresses
  • Category:Min posthumous empresses to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) posthumous empresses
  • Category:Min Kingdom eunuchs to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) eunuchs
  • Category:People executed by Min Kingdom to Category:People executed by Min (Ten Kingdoms)
  • Category:Min Kingdom generals to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) generals
  • Category:Min Kingdom jiedushi to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) jiedushi
  • Category:Min Kingdom shumishi to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) shumishi
  • Category:Min Kingdom government officials to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) government officials
  • Category:Min Kingdom chancellors to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) chancellors
  • Category:Min Kingdom rulers to Category:Min (Ten Kingdoms) rulers
  • Category:Prefectures of Min Kingdom to Category:Prefectures of Min (Ten Kingdoms)
• Category:Substituted amphetamines to Category:Amphetamines – C2C: Non-standard chemical class category name. See here (i.e., only a single use of "Substituted" in a chemical category name on all of Wiki) and compare other closely related category names like Category:Phenethylamines, Category:Beta-Hydroxyamphetamines, Category:Methamphetamines, Category:Cathinones, Category:Tryptamines, and so forth. – 76.174.0.57 (talk) 18:46, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose The main article of the category is Substituted amphetamine. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 18:50, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

  Yes, but see reasoning above and compare Category:Phenethylamines and Substituted phenethylamine, Category:Beta-Hydroxyamphetamines and Substituted β-hydroxyamphetamine, Category:Cathinones and Substituted cathinone, Category:Tryptamines and Substituted tryptamine, and so forth. Category:Substituted amphetamines is an outlier and goes against standards, including within its own category tree (it's a subcategory of Category:Phenethylamines and it contains the Category:Beta-Hydroxyamphetamines, Category:Methamphetamines, and Category:Cathinones categories). There is no reason for this inconsistency and it makes using these categories (i.e., knowing/remembering whether the category has the prefix "Substituted" in its name) more tedious than it needs to be. – 76.174.0.57 (talk) 18:57, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Women's National Basketball Association Western Conference standings navigational boxes to Category:Western Conference (WNBA) standings navigational boxes – C2B: per Western Conference (WNBA). Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 18:44, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Women's National Basketball Association Eastern Conference standings navigational boxes to Category:Eastern Conference (WNBA) standings navigational boxes – C2B: per Eastern Conference (WNBA). Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 18:43, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:National League standings templates to Category:National League (baseball) standings templates – C2B: per National League (baseball). Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 18:41, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:WHA minor league affiliates by team to Category:World Hockey Association minor league affiliates by team – C2B: per World Hockey Association/Category:World Hockey Association. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 18:39, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose speedy, per Category:NHL minor league affiliates by team. That sets the naming convention as to use the abbreviation for affiliate categories; if the WHA one is moved, the NHL one would need to be moved as well. This warrants more of a discussion to find a consensus. Tom Danson (talk) 19:48, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Clara Zetkin bibliography to Category:Works by German writers – C2F – Fayenatic London 16:27, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Mubarak Al-Kabeer Governorate to Category:Mubarak Al-Kabeer (governorate) – C2D: per Mubarak Al-Kabeer (governorate). Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 14:02, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:Districts of Mubarak Al-Kabeer Governorate to Category:Districts of Mubarak Al-Kabeer (governorate)
• Category:Al Asimah Governorate (Kuwait) to Category:Capital Governorate (Kuwait) – C2D: per Capital Governorate (Kuwait). Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 13:58, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:Areas of Capital Governorate to Category:Areas of Capital Governorate (Kuwait)
• Category:Al Farwaniyah Governorate to Category:Farwaniya Governorate – C2D: per Farwaniya Governorate. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 13:55, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:Districts of Al Farwaniyah Governorate to Category:Districts of Farwaniya Governorate
• Category:Al Ahmadi Governorate to Category:Ahmadi Governorate – C2D: per Ahmadi Governorate. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 13:53, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:Districts of Al Ahmadi Governorate to Category:Districts of Ahmadi Governorate
• Category:Ascaridida to Category:Ascaridomorpha – C2D: The World Register of Marine Species (the authority on all marine taxa) accepts this taxa as infraorder Ascaridomorpha, with Ascaridida as an unaccepted synonym. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:39, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose speedy The main article was only recently renamed and without discussion, thus C2D doesn't apply. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 13:47, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:History of Chelsea to Category:History of Chelsea F.C. – C2C: parent is Chelsea F.C. ^SMason_Garrison 03:15, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Government ministries in Lithuania to Category:Government ministries of Lithuania – C2C: norm is of, not in see Category:Ministries by country ^SMason_Garrison 03:08, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:ICC Women's World Twenty20 to Category:Women's World Twenty20 – C2D: Post RM closure; see Women's T20 World Cup#Requested move 5 October 2024. Sennecaster (Chat) 02:41, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose as proposed The category's main article is Women's T20 World Cup so this should be renamed to Category:Women's T20 World Cup. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 13:44, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oh yup, makes sense. No objections to your proposal. Sennecaster (Chat) 18:09, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Astronomical telescopes and observatories in the Antarctic to Category:Astronomical observatories in the Antarctic – C2C: parent is Astronomical observatories ^SMason_Garrison 02:18, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Grand Muftis of Syria to Category:Grand muftis of Syria – C2A: It should be renamed per WP:C2A TheBirdsShedTears (talk) 16:16, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Theatre directors from Czechoslovakia to Category:Czechoslovak theatre directors – C2C: Norm is Czechoslovak FOO ^SMason_Garrison 00:15, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Non-binary gender to Category:Non-binary gender identities – C2A: Non-binary is not just one gender; neither are the pages listed in this category. This name would use proper terminology. Ranleo09 (talk) 15:17, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Oppose, as with most gender-related topics, this is contentious and needs further discussion. Funcrunch (talk) 15:34, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Fictional works to Category:Fictional creative works – C2C: Rename to match parent category, Category:Creative works. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 08:05, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose Most of the subcategories in Category:Creative works just uses works. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 14:02, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Bankstown Line to Category:Sydney Trains – C2F. AusLondonder (talk) 18:19, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

  Comment The category is now empty. The only article that was in it was redirected. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 21:16, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

  I tagged it for speedy deletion. Ymblanter (talk) 06:12, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Finance ministers of Belgium to Category:Ministers of finance of Belgium – C2D: Minister of Finance (Belgium) + C2C/C2A with similar categories. Hey man im josh (talk) 16:46, 31 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Defense ministers of Japan to Category:Ministers of defense of Japan – C2D: Minister of Defense (Japan) + C2C/C2A with similar categories. Hey man im josh (talk) 16:44, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  We had specific issues with one type of ministers, but I do not remember which ones - were they ministers of defense? Ymblanter (talk) 13:59, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  @Hey man im josh and Fayenatic london:

  @Ymblanter, my understanding of the issue is that it was proposed to rename everything to "Defence/Defense ministers", which is where the push back came from. Not every country calls their minister that, but would instead use "Minister of Defense/Defence", which was the point made when that was initially opposed. This is why I'm linking Minister of Defense (Japan) in this case, to show that that's the title used. Also noting that you ping failed, as it did not have a signature to go along with it. Pinging Fayenatic london since that one failed. Hey man im josh (talk) 14:18, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  Hey man im josh if you're thinking of labour ministers, the discussion is still on this page. National usage should rule in these cases, so follow lead article C2D if there is one – unless it appears poorly named; otherwise follow the usage in biography articles – I would allow this as Speedy under C2B. If there is not a predominant national usage, then apply C2C, following the majority of siblings. – Fayenatic London 11:01, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

  I was thinking of an old discussion regarding defense ministers actually @Fayenatic london. The labour ministers discussion is somewhat similar. The C2C mention is due to the removal of the brackets in this case. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:58, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

  Probably this previous Speedy discussion of selected finance ministers. – Fayenatic London 15:23, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

  Yes, that's definitely one of the conversations we've had about this in the past. I've added it to one of my many bookmark folders for reference. Based on that, I do believe these titles are correct. They're just a bit more of a pain to go through than the easy mass C2A requests I made to downcase many minister categories. Hey man im josh (talk) 15:27, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Labor ministers by country to Category:Labour ministers by country – C2C: To match parent Category:Labour ministers. AusLondonder (talk) 20:58, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

  @AusLondonder: I actually think it should be renamed to Category:Ministers of labour by country, based on Minister of labour. I alos believe that Category:Labour ministers should thus be renamed to Category:Ministers of labour. Hey man im josh (talk) 12:00, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  The only question I have about that is consistency with the category tree Category:Government ministers by portfolio. AusLondonder (talk) 12:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  Yes, I think there are issues with that category in general @AusLondonder. I believe they were highlighted at one point when someone attempted to mass rename all of the Ministers of defense categories to defense ministers, by, I want to say, Secretlondon? Hey man im josh (talk) 12:53, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  Yeah I remember an objection at some point earlier this year to a nomination to standardise these categories but can't recall the details. AusLondonder (talk) 13:00, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  @AusLondonder (sorry for repeated pinging, just don't want you to think I haven't responded or anything): My understanding, at the time, was that some countries do call their ministers "Defense minister" whereas others use "Minister of defense", so it would/should be a case by case basis. Not sure how we properly apply that to the general parent categories though. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:20, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  No need to apologise, yes that sounds familiar. If I have the time I might look back and see if I can find the discussion. AusLondonder (talk) 13:24, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  @Fayenatic london: Ymblanter (talk) 20:19, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  Nice question! I think C2D could override C2C for Labour ministers, because (i) there are no country-specific titles listed at Minister of Labour which use "labour minister", and (ii) there is the potential ambiguity with Labour parties. The national sub-cats should probably be renamed "Ministers of/for labour" according to local usage. For the UK we could use the current ministerial title, Category:Secretaries of state for work and pensions, but that doesn't identify the country, so maybe keep a generic title as a parent. – Fayenatic London 17:40, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

  Should we send this to a full CFD to discuss? Or can we move to Category:Ministers of labour by country if everyone agrees? Ymblanter (talk) 06:26, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

  I'd support that move personally. Hey man im josh (talk) 20:29, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Opposed requests

• Category:Cave diving explorers to Category:Cave divers – C2C: Rename to a more easily understandable, and one that is used within the sport. Kingsmasher678 (talk) 19:24, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  @Kingsmasher678: How is this a WP:C2C? The parent category is Underwater diving explorers, so I think this rename would go against consistency. jlwoodwa (talk) 19:28, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  For the diving categories it may be consistent, but the cave/caving articles all refer to these people as "cave divers", like cavers not being called "underground caving explorers".

  Kingsmasher678 (talk) 19:42, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  WP:C2C is about category naming conventions, not the wording used in articles. jlwoodwa (talk) 20:26, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  What I am saying is that the category naming conventions in the cave space do not reflect the current name of the category. Cave diving falls under that space at least as much as it does under the scuba section, and this is the correct term. If I didn't use the correct rational, please let me know a better one!

  Kingsmasher678 (talk) 21:57, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  • @Kingsmasher678: if you want to pursue this you really need to take it to full discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:54, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Albanian Air Force to Category:Military of Albania – C2F: Contains only the eponymous article Albanian Air Force. jlwoodwa (talk) 06:05, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose Article has now 3 articles. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 22:40, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Climate of Virginia to Category:Environment of Virginia – C2F: Contains only the eponymous article Climate of Virginia. jlwoodwa (talk) 20:23, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose speedy I added Climate change in Virginia in the category, so it now has more than one entry. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 21:48, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:2025 in Sri Lanka to Category:2025 by country – C2F. AusLondonder (talk) 17:00, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose Now it also has a subcategory. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 21:10, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:4th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:4th-century Maharajadhirajas – "Maharajadhiraja" is consistently capitalised in sources per ngrams. PadFoot (talk) 16:40, 1 November 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:5th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:5th-century Maharajadhirajas
  • Category:6th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:6th-century Maharajadhirajas
  • Category:7th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:7th-century Maharajadhirajas
  • Category:8th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:8th-century Maharajadhirajas
  • Category:10th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:10th-century Maharajadhirajas
  • Category:11th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:11th-century Maharajadhirajas
  • Category:12th-century maharajadhirajas to Category:12th-century Maharajadhirajas

@PadFoot2008: Your ngram uses the singular version of the term. Wouldn't MOS:JOBTITLES apply in this case? Hey man im josh (talk) 17:34, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Hello @Hey man im josh, plural still shows consistency in use of capitalised [2]. PadFoot (talk) 01:18, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

That ngram appears to actually not be showing the downcased version, but I'm not understanding why MOS:JOBTITLES wouldn't apply in this situation. It also looks like you created all of the categories yourself, so you must have also thought it should be downcased at one point. Perhaps this nomination would benefit from a CFD instead of a speedy renaming. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:36, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

WP:MOS overrides style elsewhere (e.g. evidence from Ngrams). So I think these categories should be left as they are. – Fayenatic London 11:04, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

I have only tagged these categories now.--Ymblanter (talk) 20:48, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Prussian Ministers of War to Category:Ministers of war of Prussia – C2C. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:23, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose as proposed This should be renamed to Category:War ministers of Prussia per List of war ministers of Prussia and the convention in Category:Government ministers of Prussia. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 18:20, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

  @Armbrust: I don't believe the Government ministers category in relevant in this situation, but I recognize that List of war ministers of Prussia would be. Oddly enough... the person who started that article made the lead This page lists Prussian Ministers of War. I don't have access to the source to verify whether war minister or minister of war was the title used. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:39, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Civil Services of Andhra Pradesh to Category:Civil services of Andhra Pradesh – C2A. Hey man im josh (talk) 12:50, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose per Civil Services of India. MOS:JOBTITLES doesn't apply for this. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 19:51, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

  In this instance, I wasn't attempting to apply MOS:JOBTITLES, I simply did not see it as a proper noun, and I still don't. But I recognize that it does not make sense to not match the capitalization of the article there. I will consider a move discussion and am happy to withdraw this request for the time being @Armbrust. Hey man im josh (talk) 13:33, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Wikipedia:GLAM/NARA participants to Category:Wikipedia-National Archives and Records Administration collaboration participants – C2C. Gonnym (talk) 13:34, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Wikipedia:GLAM/MoMA participants to Category:Wikipedia-Museum of Modern Art collaboration participants – C2C. Gonnym (talk) 13:34, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Wikipedia:GLAM/The Met participants to Category:Wikipedia-Metropolitan Museum of Art collaboration participants – C2C. Gonnym (talk) 13:33, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Wikipedia:GLAM/TCMI participants to Category:Wikipedia-The Children's Museum of Indianapolis collaboration participants – C2C. Gonnym (talk) 13:33, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:WikiProject GLAM/AAA participants to Category:Wikipedia-Archives of American Art collaboration participants – C2C with parent category. Gonnym (talk) 13:31, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:WikiProject GLAM/SI participants to Category:Wikipedia-Smithsonian Institution collaboration participants – C2C with parent category. Gonnym (talk) 13:31, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:WikiProject GLAM/IMJ participants to Category:Wikipedia-Israel Museum, Jerusalem collaboration participants – C2C with parent category. Gonnym (talk) 13:30, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:Wikipedia:GLAM/TP participants to Category:Wikipedia-Museum of New Zealand Te Papa Tongarewa collaboration participants – C2C with parent category. Gonnym (talk) 13:28, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose speedy for GLAM categories. There is no clear convention for the proposed format. The parent categories by themself are not enough to establish that. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 03:53, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

  • @Gonnym: are you planning to take these to full discussion? Marcocapelle (talk) 09:02, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Amazon Game Studios games to Category:Amazon Games games – C2B: per Amazon Games. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 17:26, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

  @Gonnym: could you please have a look? Ymblanter (talk) 21:34, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose rename, instead split. Thanks for the ping. Only New World (video game) was released after the name change. The list at Amazon Games has more than these 3 games so there shouldn't be an issue of small categories if populated correctly. On a tangent note, our naming convention for this type of stuff is confusing and the category explanation isn't helpful either. Produced and distributed are two different things (and we use "developed" for games in the infobox). Gonnym (talk) 10:48, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

  • @Armbrust: would you want to create and populate Category:Amazon Games games per Gonnym, or would you take this to full discussion? Marcocapelle (talk) 08:59, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:PWHL New York to Category:New York Sirens – C2D. User:Namiba 14:14, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:PWHL New York players to Category:New York Sirens players
• Category:PWHL Montreal coaches to Category:Montreal Victoire coaches – C2D. User:Namiba 14:14, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:PWHL Boston to Category:Boston Fleet – C2D. User:Namiba 14:12, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
  • Category:PWHL Boston coaches to Category:Boston Fleet coaches
  • Category:PWHL Boston seasons to Category:Boston Fleet seasons
• Category:PWHL Montreal to Category:Montreal Victoire – C2D. User:Namiba 14:48, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
• Category:PWHL Ottawa to Category:Ottawa Charge – C2D. User:Namiba 14:07, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

  Contesting all PWHL moves. Discussion should be had as to whether these should be separate categories pre- and post-rebrand. Wheatzilopochtli (talk) 16:10, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

  • @Namiba: are you planning to take these to full discussion? Marcocapelle (talk) 08:52, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

    Yes--User:Namiba 22:07, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

On hold pending other discussion

• None currently

Moved to full discussion

• Category:20th-century explorers from the Russian Empire to Category:20th-century Russian explorers – C2C: The norm is for the 20th century to be Russian FOO ^SMason_Garrison 03:20, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose speedy All of the entries in the category were born before 1917, and thus in the Russian Empire. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 22:08, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

  Would you like me to remove them? The norm is for this category to be called Category:20th-century Russian FOO. Are they not also russian? I do not see why this category should be treated differently than every other 20th-century Russian people category. @Armbrust Are you still opposed? ^SMason_Garrison 20:38, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose a valid item in the subtree category:Explorers by former country. --Altenmann >talk 21:07, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

  I already moved this to a full nomination. Why are you opposing here?^SMason_Garrison 02:26, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

• Category:Pre-1876 life peers to Category:Life peers created before 1876 – C2C: with subcategories, and generally clearer — RAVENPVFF · talk · 18:22, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

  Oppose: Not a list of peers created (i.e. born, or conceived) before 1876, but of peerages. “Category:Life peerages created before 1876” or “Category:Life peerages before 1876” would useful and not inaccurate, and “List of life peerages before 1876” (not category) already exists. Stephan Leeds (talk) 00:47, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

  @Stephan Leeds: true, but all the subcats use "Life peers created by…", so the nomination was valid under C2C. Do you want to nominate the cat and its sub-(sub-)cats for a full CFD? – Fayenatic London 21:32, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

  @Stephan Leeds: This category contains biographical articles about peers (people), not articles about peerages (titles), so the category tree name is correct. As Fayenatic london stated, this is the same as all other subcategories, e.g. Category:Life peers created by Charles III. — RAVENPVFF · talk · 16:02, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

  Now at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 November 9#Category:Pre-1876 life peers. HouseBlaster (talk • he/they) 00:01, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

Ready for deletion

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